I want to discuss a problem that is becoming more and more obvious the deeper we get into season 3: they are not setting themselves up well for a full season 4. The Dance is long and bloody, with major characters dying constantly, replaced by fresh faces. For the last stretch of the show, with Daemon, Aemond, Cole, Ormund, and Gwayne dead, the story begins to rest on other characters: Joffrey, Aegon the Younger, Benjicot Blackwood, Black Aly, and Kermit (here Oscar) Tully, and Cregan Stark. Trystane Truefyre, Gaemon Palehair, and the Shepherd. And the Dragonseeds, Ulf, Hugh, and Addam.

None of these characters have really been developed. Aegon the Younger is nowhere to be found. They passed on an opportunity to finally give Joffrey a second line of dialogue in favor of having Rhaenyra... look at him? Benjicot has maybe been rolled into Oscar, who finally delivered one cryptic line last episode, but he’s not much of a character. Aly has been, presumably, on-screen, but hasn’t said a word. Cregan Stark had a short scene at the start of season 2, but rather than delve into Jace’s Winterfell storyline to help flesh him out they were content with one conversation on the Wall. The Dragonseeds had more development in season 2 when they were less relevant than they do now that they’ve actually become dragonriders. Addam is perhaps the most-developed, but even he still feels pretty flat.

Clearly there are further big changes coming to the story. These characters can’t lead episodes on their own. With how much they’re developing Ormund, and how little they’re developing Daeron, he will likely survive First Tumbleton and be around for Second Tumbleton, or maybe Hugh will kill him in between. Gwayne will likely survive and join at Tumbleton.

Joffrey may end up taking the place of Aegon the Younger, maybe he just takes the “Targaryen-flavored” name of Aegon upon his accession. I don’t see how they can satisfyingly end the story with the coronation of a character we have never really met.

The Moon of the Three Kings will likely become the Moon of the One King or some other sort of truncated version. The High Septon may take the place of the Shepherd.

The Battle of the Kingsroad will likely play out about as described, even though the characters are kinda weak. I expect some minor development of them in the preceding two-ish episodes.

I think Corlys will play a bigger role during the Hour of the Wolf. I don’t expect him to be imprisoned by Cregan or threatened with execution. It might wind up becoming the Hour of the Seahorse.

_____________________________________________________________

What do you all think? Do you wish they were developing these future characters now, like I do?

The Odyssey film is being released today (though it looks like I won’t be able to get tickets in IMAX for a few weeks) and I wanted to continue with another post comparing ideas in Game of Thrones and epics by Homer. 

Earlier in the week I posted an article about the Influence of The Iliad on David Benioff, George R.R. Martin, Troy and Game of Thrones by examining parallels between ideas, events, and storylines.

In this new article, I explore some concepts that underlie important themes in Greek literature generally and The Iliad specifically. The concepts of Aristeia, Kleos, and Timé relate to glory and honor and how they are achieved and expressed. These themes are at the core of The Iliad and are captured and expressed throughout Troy and Game of Thrones.  I hope everyone finds this new piece interesting.

Something I noticed in this scene where Cersei talks to Sansa during the Battle of the Blackwater, she states that she was four when her mother had just died.

Oberyn later tells Tyrion that he and his sister Elia had come to Casterly Rock to visit with their father (in the books, their mother) after Tyrion had just been born (“the Rock was deep in mourning.”) In the books, Cersei and Jaime are 9 when this visit happens, and Oberyn and Elia are in their early teens.

In the conversation with Tyrion, Oberyn mentions that every day he and Elia would ask to see Tyrion, and every day Cersei would delay and put them off. When they finally do see Tyrion, Cersei physically assaults him and says “it doesn’t matter. He’ll be dead soon, everyone says so; I hope they’re right.”

I could maybe believe that a very precocious, very intelligent four-year-old could repeat these words if she heard them enough, but I’m struggling with the idea that a four-year-old girl would be the gatekeeper to her infant brother, and that anyone would have to repeatedly petition this toddler (even a precocious one) to visit Tyrion.

I assume it was a throwaway line in the show, which is fine, but Oberyn’s later comments to Tyrion make Cersei’s stated age of 4 when all this happened at Casterly Rock fairly absurd.

As I posted yesterday, The Odyssey and The Iliad (both by “Homer”) provided a lot of inspiration for elements in Game of Thrones and both works were part of my post-Game of Thrones reading and writing journey.  The Odyssey film comes out on Friday but (partly to avoid spoilers for anyone intending to see the film but not familiar with The Odyssey) I wanted to first post this piece about The Iliad (and the movie “Troy”) which takes place before The Odyssey.  The Iliad primarily focuses on Achilles and a few other characters (including Odysseus, the main character of The Odyssey) during a short period towards the end of the Trojan War.  
I definitely found Game of Thrones parallels and connections in The Odyssey, but aspects of The Iliad (and the making of “Troy”) seemed particularly inspirational to the creators of Game of Thrones.  As I wrote in the article: “In reading this often graphically violent tale and exploring the key characters, events, and important themes, it becomes increasingly clear that The Iliad and its related lore have influenced the creators of Game of Thrones, their writing, and their stories.”
I hope you find some of these Homer/Game of Thrones connections as interesting as I did.

People complain that adult Rhaenyra has none of young Rhaenyra’s sass or spark, but I actually don’t think the script supports that at all. She served roasted rat to make a point last episode! But older Rhaenyra’s shenanigans are largely received as cringey writing or incompetent character choices by the audience instead of high risk, high reward entertainment.

I absolutely LOVE Emma’s portrayal, and I still find myself laughing out loud at older Rhae’s audacity multiple times an episode. But Emma’s vibe is just different from Milly’s, and it seems like a large segment of the audience isn’t connecting to it.

Milly’s Rhae feels spunky. Her audacity is amusing. Her big swings are charming. Her features, voice, and delivery have a sharpness and specificity that is easy to be hooked by.

Emma’s Rhae is subtler, sadder. Their voice is deep and round. They do fantastic face-work, but the experience of the character as a whole is more obscure. I don’t feel like I know her Rhaenyra as well, so I have to think about the character’s choices longer to understand how I’m supposed to feel about them.

Combined with the clunky writing choices, shortened schedule/budget, writers strike- I can see why some people don’t connect with older Rhaenyra yet.

EDIT
I completely agree it’s reasonable for Rhaenyra’s vibe to change. It’s been decades and she’s experienced a lot of loss and life since then. Of course she’s different, and I think her changes are very realistic to the character they set up in season 1! I love Emma’s portrayal.

My comment was more meta - I don’t actually think the script characterization of her is that different from season 1. But the overall experience of her is very different. There’s various contributing factors, one of which is Emma’s general vibe.

Just watched the penultimate episode, and I'm having a hard time understanding her reasoning. Just a few minutes earlier in the episode, she agreed that if the bells were rung, she would stop using her dragon. That happens and they surrender , yet she still goes on to burn the entire city.

Her whole argument throughout the series was that she wasn't like her father. Was all of that fake? Couldn't she see that she was burning innocent people? It's hard to believe she would suddenly become the literal Mad King just because Cersei killed Missandei. Why not fly straight to the Red Keep, where Cersei was, and take her revenge? Why burn innocent people?

I read someone saying she did it because she wanted people to fear her, and because Jon was a threat to her claim, she needed to show everyone how dangerous she could be. But that's literally the opposite of what she's been saying and doing for the last seven seasons. It just doesn't make sense.

Imo they should have explained her decision much better. At the very least, it needed a few more episodes to properly develop that transformation.

Hello Naath Community.
Most of us are probably focused on House of the Dragon this month but I want to direct everyone's attention to another Game of Thrones related media event taking place this week: The release of Christopher Nolan's film The Odyssey.

What does The Odyssey have to do with Game of Thrones? Quite a lot I have learned.
Watching Game of Thrones in the 2010s was an amazing experience for me and I credit it for many things including rekindling my interest in fantasy and epic fiction in general. When the show ended, I felt drawn to explore whether classic works (which I had never read) had any conceptual ties to Game of Thrones. I read and took discussion courses on The Odyssey in 2021, Herodotus in 2022, The Iliad in 2023, and then various Greek Myths in 2024.  It became quickly apparent to me that The Odyssey and The Iliad (both by “Homer”) provided a lot of inspiration for elements in Game of Thrones and I have written a few pieces about the connections between the stories which I will post here in the days ahead.  I hope everyone finds them interesting.

I've been a regular here for a couple of years and I still find it's a generally safe place to retreat for levelheaded conversation. The main subs are enjoying this season of HotD for the most part. However when the haters come out they come out in droves and there's no escape. If I have to hear one more fucking child say "Wahhhhh the books are better this shit makes no sense!!!!!" with some incomprehensible slang and probably a bunch of emojis thrown in.... Well I don't know what I will actually do but at least I know I can come here to vent.

Appreciate you guys <3

Season 3 Episode 4: Tumbleton

Air Date: July 12, 2026

Synopsis: Ormund's invasion of Tumbleton forces Rhaenyra into a corner.

Directed by: Clare Kilner

Written by: David Hancock

Trying in a new sub because r/HotD has no sense of whimsy.

My initial thought was 1-3, bc thats the episode I was on. Imagine Millie pouting and being bratty in the carriage next to a hugely pregnant Olivia, trying hard to be the conciliator, emphasizing how different their lives our now.

This also sets up an opportunity for an on-screen switch between Milly and Emma, which is a little ridiculous for tv but satisfying in a theatrical way. I was genuinely confused which blonde Targaryen was on-screen after the season 1 time jump. But having Milly go into the kingswood and Emma emerge with the boar could have been a visual hand-off of the role. Or even better, in episode 5 pre- and post-Cole bedding.

How would you re-structure the handoff of the roles?

Hi everyone. I was one of the few people who was fine with the end of the show and didn’t fall into the mass psychosis that the internet did. Now I’m feeling nostalgic and want to watch some YouTube reactions. However it’s proving hard to find people who really get the show and are fine with the ending. I wanted to ask if anybody knows of reactors that fulfill these criteria and I figured here is the best place to ask because I know I’m amongst like minded people.

Season 3 Episode 3: Rhaenyra Triumphant

Air Date: July 5, 2026

Synopsis: Rhaenyra learns the situation in King's Landing is not what she anticipated. Unable to locate her enemies, and with demands coming from all sides, Rhaenyra must navigate a delicate balance between appeasing her supporters and consolidating her rule.

Directed by: Clare Kilner

Written by: Sara Hess

Hello,

I just uploaded a video on youtube reacting to a youtuber putting the blame for Georges failure to finish his own books on all the tv shows within hbos cinematic thrones universe:

https://youtu.be/b9x-RdkMqyg?is=cjZYHhSTumiJdfUE